GearboxIt’s been a whopping six years since the last mainline Borderlands title, and gaming has changed a lot. To that end, Borderlands 4 isn’t just a sequel; it’s a chance for the franchise to return to its roots and realize its grand ambitions.“This is a Borderlands game through and through, but it’s seamless,” Gearbox CEO Randy Pitchford tells Inverse. “That’s always been the ambition, we just couldn’t – because you have these load times, and we have to pinch you off and make a transition and just move data around, make you wait while we load s*** in. The technology finally caught up to that ambition.”Borderlands 4 is clearly the series’ biggest title, and a chance to win back fans that might not have gelled with the previous entry. With just days before release, Inverse had the chance to talk to Pitchford and writer Sam Winkler about crafting Vault Hunters, the new ground they hope to break, and the hopeful future of the franchise.This interview has been edited for clarity and brevity.You've talked a lot about how this is the biggest Borderlands game – not quite open world, but with elements of it. But it also seems to be going back to the series’ roots. How are you trying to embrace both ideas?Pitchford: These aren't mutually exclusive ideas. I think if you play Borderlands 1, you’ll see that ambition has always been there for us – we wish we could have a seamless world. The only reason we don’t say open world is because there are some expectations of specific kinds of play that only happen in open world games.Winkler: For me, games that stick with me are not verbs, they're places. I want to go back to that space and feel like I’m there. And when I played Borderlands 1, Pandora, it felt like I was traversing a space that didn’t give a s*** about me, and I had to make it give a s*** about me. With [Borderland 4’s new planet] Kairos, we had that opportunity to say, okay, you’re going to make your mark on this world, but it’s up to you what direction you’re going. And it felt really cool to go beyond the more structured, please go here. We pull you in all sorts of different directions.There are four new Vault Hunters to choose from, with another one on the way post-launch. | GearboxWe’ve seen so many Vault Hunters over the years. How do you create compelling new Vault Hunters who players can connect with on a deeper level?Pitchford: It’s a fun process. When we blended role-playing games with shooters, where the game’s about shooting people and taking their s***, we had to make an entire universe where that’s okay. We have to build a universe to make that feel great, and at the center of that is the Vault Hunters, because that’s who you are. So Vault Hunters shoot things and take their s***, which you think is a terrible thing, but we’ve made it a class of nobility.Winkler: If you put it in San Diego, it’d be a problem. Everyone involved would be insane.Pitchford: Sam and I have actually worked on a bunch of characters now. I’ve been there since the beginning, and there are a lot of different ways it happens, especially with Vault Hunters. Sometimes the initial point is a look and feel, sometimes the initial point is a backstory. Sometimes it’s a piece of concept art. It varies for each one.Usually, we’re doing a lot of this in parallel, and dreaming up a lot of different s***. Then we notice that this really clever design thing fits perfectly here with this amazing look and feel, and this concept over here, this backstory, and they just converge. That’s how the winners tend to show us that they deserve to be winners, and we listen.Winkler: It’s all about questions. We always have 10 ideas for every one that we can execute on. So it’s like, could this type of character work in this world? Nick and Tommy, who are the character designers, are making the systems; they’ve got this pile of ideas. As big as this game is, we only have so much time to make all of it.Pitchford: This is the curse of being a creative. The ideas come infinitely faster than they can ever be manifested. Everything we do at Gearbox is made by someone; there is a human being who puts their heart and soul, sweat, and tears on the line. That’s important to get it to happen. It’s not AI; we can’t just give a prompt to an AI. We are hand-crafting every little detail, and it’s f****** hard.Winkler: It’s difficult in ways that other media isn’t. If I’m shooting a film and say, “Hey, my character needs a cup,” they’re like, “Okay, grab a cup and put it on camera.” If I need a cup in a cutscene of a video game, three different departments are like, “Oh god, okay. Let’s figure out the concept of the cup. Is there anything in the cup? Now we have to invent fluid dynamics.” So the most innocuous things, which should be easy or an afterthought, become a consideration.Borderlands 4’s Vault Hunters are meant to feel more grounded and realistic, while still embracing the series’ typical humor. | GearboxHumor has always been a big part of Borderlands, but it’s been six years since Borderlands 3. How do you keep the humor relevant, and adjust it for new players?Pitchford: Super easy, fart jokes. The whole game is just 100% endless toilet humor, non-stop. That’s sarcasm, internet. We’re not above toilet humor, but you’ve gotta be judicious with it.Winkler: Yes, highly curated fart jokes. There are a lot of comedies that stand the test of time. You watch one and go, “This was funny in 1970, and it’s still funny.” It’s almost always going to be character-centric stuff that is funny in context, no matter what else is going on in life. You might have extra layers of whatever the political landscape is, but if it’s funny within the bounds of the screen you’re watching it on, then it’s gonna work.And that’s where we really put a lot of our eggs in the basket. We said, “Okay, let’s make sure that these characters do crack jokes, they end up in wacky circumstances, but they’re aware of it. They are cracking jokes because their friend just bought it, and they’re trying to cope with that.” It’s grounded and realistic, where I think at our worst, it’d be just like, oh, someone wanted to make a joke about some headlines. We’re just moving the needle to where it’s diegetic.Pitchford: I think the most important point is that Borderlands isn’t a comedy, but it’s also not a drama. It’s both and it’s neither. Borderlands lives in a “borderland” between comedy and drama, and that’s literally everything in the game. We take things that don’t belong and force them together, in that uncomfortable borderland – RPG and shooter, comedy and drama, realism and surrealism, even the characters tend to live in a space where they’re between who they are and who they want to be. I think a lot of us feel that, and it’s one of the reasons Borderlands is so relatable. Because we’re all shades of grey, and Borderlands embraces that and puts us in that muddy spot between things that don’t belong.Like the first two games, Borderlands 4 takes place on a single world, but now it’s a “seamless” experience. | GearboxI wanted to get a bit of insight into the Timekeeper and creating a new villain, especially since Handsome Jack is seen as one of the best villains ever created.Pitchford: Oh yeah, here comes the “You made the best video game villain ever in the history of life. How are you gonna live up to that again?” You gotta go the opposite, and that’s what we did with the Timekeeper.Because Jack, he’s the worst person in the world, but you kind of love it. The Timekeeper, this guy is not f****** around. There’s nothing to like here, nothing to relate to, and absolutely nothing to enjoy. He will not make you laugh. He is f****** serious. Darth Vader is a comedian compared to the Timekeeper.There’s no way you’re gonna do [Jack] again. We tried with the Calypso Twins, you can’t live up to that. The high water mark was set. I’m sorry, [writer] Anthony Burch is a god, and [voice actor Dameon Clarke] crushes it. Sorry, everyone, for the rest of video games, don’t try and make a villain that’s fun.Winkler: With Handsome Jack, he constantly calls you up to tell you he’s better than you, you’re worthless, you suck, everything like that. But also, around the fifth time, he’s kind of obsessed with you. Like, you sure think about me a lot.The Timekeeper sees you as an ant. He doesn’t care, and he does have better s*** to do. You have to make it personal for him. He’s like, you have my attention, are you sure you want it? And so we’re chipping away at this constructed order of his, and you start to chip away at his own edifice of how he doesn’t care about you.As you might expect, there will be plenty of new guns for you to get your grubby hands on. | GearboxWith six years between now and Borderlands 3, what does success look like for Borderlands 4? Where do you want it to take the series?Pitchford: I’ve literally dedicated my life to making entertainment. And my best hope is that we’ve, in any way, delivered that for someone. If we’ve got someone that’s like, “Man, I’m glad this exists,” I feel like we've done it. So the baseline is even if just one person is so glad we gave them joy and happiness, it was a gift. If they feel it in their hearts, that’s all I need.Then the next step is, on the business side, can the suits care about it? Are they happy enough where they say, “Hey Randy, can you and your team do more?” All we want to do is spend our lives making s*** for you guys, that’s it.I’ve been working on Borderlands now for over 20 years, and we’re starting to get pretty good at it. I feel like there’s a lot of work to do. Borderlands games are pretty good; there’s a reason so many people love them. But I think we suck, we suck so bad, and I just want another go so we can suck a little less.Winkler: One of the first things we talked about with Borderlands 4, was where the hell do we go from Borderlands 3? We opened up the galaxy, we’re seeing these different planets, did we just exponentially expand this world? And the answer was yes.So, going to Kairos was a very focused storytelling decision. But holy s***, this is a big world, and like I said, we have a lot of ideas that we haven’t even touched on. So for me, Borderlands 4 is just the start of a new era.Pitchford: You know, with the lore, you’re already imagining all the people that get into the lore and go, ‘Oh, I had no idea how big this universe was.” Because with Borderlands 4, we’re finally showing people – some thought they knew – what the boundaries of this universe were.Winkler: There’s s*** you started cooking in Borderlands 1 that we’re going to pay off, and I’m just psyched for that.Borderlands 4 launches on September 12 for PS5, Xbox Series X|S, and PC, and on October 3 for Nintendo Switch 2.